Assume the Initial Market Position at the Broker  [SOLVED]

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DTorSwing
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Assume the Initial Market Position at the Broker

Postby DTorSwing » 16 Jan 2015

http://www.multicharts.com/trading-soft ... r_Settings

1) Assume the Initial Market Position at the Broker is the SAME AS on the CHART when automation is enabled.
2) Use the actual position at the broker - the initial position will be the same as actual position at the broker when automation is enabled.

out of the 2 choices, which one would you choose when you resume strategy after a disconnect
I am running strategy from MC to TWS and working out choices

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Andrew MultiCharts
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Re: Assume the Initial Market Position at the Broker

Postby Andrew MultiCharts » 16 Jan 2015

Hello DTorSwing,

The best one is "Use the actual position at the broker" - the initial position will be the same as actual postition at the broker when automation is enabled.

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Re: Assume the Initial Market Position at the Broker

Postby DTorSwing » 16 Jan 2015

thks Andrew. that's what I wanted to use for safer side,

would it do the same for stop and target order also ? and not just Open position

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Re: Assume the Initial Market Position at the Broker

Postby Andrew MultiCharts » 16 Jan 2015

would it do the same for stop and target order also ? and not just Open position
Only for positions. All active orders must be removed manually before you start automation, otherwise the strategy will not "see" them.

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Re: Assume the Initial Market Position at the Broker

Postby DTorSwing » 16 Jan 2015

would it do the same for stop and target order also ? and not just Open position
Only for positions. All active orders must be removed manually before you start automation, otherwise the strategy will not "see" them.
I mean stop/target that the "strategy" had before it got disconnected, beside the Open position and assume the position was all flat when automation started and strategy placed entry order with stop/target order

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Re: Assume the Initial Market Position at the Broker

Postby Andrew MultiCharts » 16 Jan 2015

would it do the same for stop and target order also ? and not just Open position
Only for positions. All active orders must be removed manually before you start automation, otherwise the strategy will not "see" them.
I mean stop/target that the "strategy" had before it got disconnected, beside the Open position and assume the position was all flat when automation started and strategy placed entry order with stop/target order
Yes, this is waht i mean too. When you start auto-trading, all active orders must be removed before that.

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Re: Assume the Initial Market Position at the Broker

Postby DTorSwing » 16 Jan 2015

would it do the same for stop and target order also ? and not just Open position
Only for positions. All active orders must be removed manually before you start automation, otherwise the strategy will not "see" them.
I mean stop/target that the "strategy" had before it got disconnected, beside the Open position and assume the position was all flat when automation started and strategy placed entry order with stop/target order
Yes, this is waht i mean too. When you start auto-trading, all active orders must be removed before that.
ok, then that's confusing and not what I wanted

here is scenario

symbol - ARIA is flat and no open/stop/target order
MC and TWS connected
strategy starts, submits a LONG order based on Trend in chart and stop/target order
internet or some lead to MultiCharts disconnected

I reconnect MultiCharts manually

I like MC to restore 3 things to where it was during disconnection
Open position
stop order
Target order

so you answer pl

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Andrew MultiCharts
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Re: Assume the Initial Market Position at the Broker  [SOLVED]

Postby Andrew MultiCharts » 16 Jan 2015

symbol - ARIA is flat and no open/stop/target order
MC and TWS connected
strategy starts, submits a LONG order based on Trend in chart and stop/target order
internet or some lead to MultiCharts disconnected

I reconnect MultiCharts manually

I like MC to restore 3 things to where it was during disconnection
Open position
stop order
Target order

so you answer pl
After you reconnect MultiCharts manually:
  1. Do not Show the Assign the Initial Market Position at the Broker Dialogue + Use the actual position at the broker
  2. Manually cancel the stop loss and the profit targer
  3. Start auto-trading

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Re: Assume the Initial Market Position at the Broker

Postby DTorSwing » 16 Jan 2015

After you reconnect MultiCharts manually:
  1. Do not Show the Assign the Initial Market Position at the Broker Dialogue + Use the actual position at the broker
  2. Manually cancel the stop loss and the profit target
  3. Start auto-trading
Thks Andrew. I wasnt aware of the part of manually cancelling "stop loss and the profit target" as I am coming from NT and never had to do there

still have 2 questions to be very sure :)

cancel stop and target order in TWS? or MC ?
After Start auto-trading, MC resubmits stop loss , the profit target and Open position ?

sorry, it took lot of discussion

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Re: Assume the Initial Market Position at the Broker

Postby Andrew MultiCharts » 16 Jan 2015

cancel stop and target order in TWS? or MC ?
It doesn't matter.
After Start auto-trading, MC resubmits stop loss , the profit target and Open position ?
Yes. It will see the position because of the Assign the Initial Market Positon feature, thus the code will fire profit target and stop loss (according to its logic).

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Re: Assume the Initial Market Position at the Broker

Postby DTorSwing » 16 Jan 2015

cancel stop and target order in TWS? or MC ?
It doesn't matter.
After Start auto-trading, MC resubmits stop loss , the profit target and Open position ?
Yes. It will see the position because of the Assign the Initial Market Positon feature, thus the code will fire profit target and stop loss (according to its logic).
Thks Andrew and appreciate that

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Re: Assume the Initial Market Position at the Broker

Postby orion » 16 Jan 2015

Andrew, I have been following this thread. I am thinking of what is best way to do this if I am trading dozens of symbols which may have outstanding stop and profit orders when trading resumes. Your post #4 said:
All active orders must be removed manually before you start automation, otherwise the strategy will not "see" them.
Also, your post #10 said:
Yes. It will see the position because of the Assign the Initial Market Positon feature, thus the code will fire profit target and stop loss (according to its logic).
Your post #4 seems to say it is a requirement to cancel the stop and profit order. However, as per your post #10, my PL code will fire profit target and stop loss orders per its logic. So what is the harm done if we let it do that and not manually cancel the stop loss and profit target before resumption? Is cancelling outstanding orders just a recommendation or a requirement (for other reasons yet unknown to me)?

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Re: Assume the Initial Market Position at the Broker

Postby DTorSwing » 16 Jan 2015

[/quote]
Your post #4 seems to say it is a requirement to cancel the stop and profit order. However, as per your post #10, my PL code will fire profit target and stop loss orders per its logic. So what is the harm done if we let it do that and not manually cancel the stop loss and profit target before resumption? Is cancelling outstanding orders just a recommendation or a requirement (for other reasons yet unknown to me)?[/quote]

Thks for stepping in, Orion

and in fact that would help if I dont have to cancel the stop/target orders.
the reason is that I would be doing 25-50 symbols to minimum, i would be afraid to cancel so many and then sit and verify if MC resubmitted all these orders and is quite a laborious task

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Re: Assume the Initial Market Position at the Broker

Postby orion » 17 Jan 2015

and in fact that would help if I dont have to cancel the stop/target orders.
the reason is that I would be doing 25-50 symbols to minimum, i would be afraid to cancel so many and then sit and verify
Indeed, I have a similar situation; hence my interest. After mulling this over I think the answer is that cancelling the outstanding stoploss and profit target orders is a requirement and not just a recommendation since otherwise there will be double orders at the broker when strategy resumes and sends stoploss and profit targets for positions for which such stop and profit orders were already sent once.

After poking around at some of the options available, I think cancelling the orders is not as painful as I first thought. MC File -> Preferences -> Trading tab has option 'Cancel active orders sent by strategy' when disabling auto trading. In the unusual case when MC crashes without cancelling active orders sent by strategy, there is option in TWS to cancel all orders.

Andrew, are the above points correct?

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Re: Assume the Initial Market Position at the Broker

Postby DTorSwing » 17 Jan 2015

and in fact that would help if I dont have to cancel the stop/target orders.
the reason is that I would be doing 25-50 symbols to minimum, i would be afraid to cancel so many and then sit and verify
Indeed, I have a similar situation; hence my interest. After mulling this over I think the answer is that cancelling the outstanding stoploss and profit target orders is a requirement and not just a recommendation since otherwise there will be double orders at the broker when strategy resumes and sends stoploss and profit targets for positions for which such stop and profit orders were already sent once.

After poking around at some of the options available, I think cancelling the orders is not as painful as I first thought. MC File -> Preferences -> Trading tab has option 'Cancel active orders sent by strategy' when disabling auto trading. In the unusual case when MC crashes without cancelling active orders sent by strategy, there is option in TWS to cancel all orders.

Andrew, are the above points correct?
well, if MC "syncs" with stop/target orders with Brokers when resumed, then there wont be double orders. I am coming from NT which syncs when resumed and also I have heard TS does sync the same way, so no double orders there as well.

ha, that's nice to see this option ""MC File -> Preferences -> Trading tab has option 'Cancel active orders sent by strategy' when disabling auto trading""

But I would love to see the orders in the screen to cancel orders when resumed :) all that i am afraid is, if MC or TWS cant see retrieve these orders after cancelling and hope that wont happen

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Re: Assume the Initial Market Position at the Broker

Postby Andrew MultiCharts » 20 Jan 2015

Your post #4 seems to say it is a requirement to cancel the stop and profit order. However, as per your post #10, my PL code will fire profit target and stop loss orders per its logic. So what is the harm done if we let it do that and not manually cancel the stop loss and profit target before resumption? Is cancelling outstanding orders just a recommendation or a requirement (for other reasons yet unknown to me)?
If you don't cancel the previously placed stop loss and profit target (which are no longer in OCO if it is not IB broker by the way), your code will place new stop loss and new profit target orders, ignoring the old ones, which may result in overfill.
the reason is that I would be doing 25-50 symbols to minimum, i would be afraid to cancel so many and then sit and verify if MC resubmitted all these orders and is quite a laborious task
In the Order and Position Tracker on the Orders tab you can make a right-click on any pending order and select "Cancel all orders".


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