Multicharts 6.0 Beta 2 feedback

note: on May 7 / 2010 the list moved to separate thread:
http://forum.tssupport.com/viewtopic.php?p=33224#33224


[edited:] The collaborative 2 cents:

List of GUI improvements which, if implemented, would make lives of MultiCharts users feel lot better:

KEYBOARD & MOUSE SHORTCUTS:

1. Copy & Paste Ctrl+C , Ctrl+V for all drawing objects on the charts. Please allow copy & paste drawings between windows - useful mostly for text objects. (productivity, Win GUI consistency)

2. Undo & Redo Ctrl+Z , Ctrl+Y for operations with chart objects (productivity, Win GUI consistency)

3. Move & copy drawing objects freely between SubCharts. (productivity)

4. Copy drawing objects by dragging and dropping while holding the Ctrl key. (productivity, same as MS Word)

5. Select multiple drawing objects by holding Shift key (productivity, same behavior as MS Word).

6. Copy, paste, and move multiple drawing objects selected together. (productivity, Win GUI consisency)

7. De-select drawing objects, Indicators, or Data series, with ESC key. (productivity, MultiCharts GUI consistency)

8. De-select any selected object(s) when chart window becomes "Inactive". (annoyance reduction, helps to keep charts clean. Reduces amount of clicks).

9. Lock Toolbars in their positions so they remain where they were. (Right-click, -> Lock Toolbars). (Removes Annoyances, Productivity. Win GUI consistency)

10. RAPID SCROLLING: [Alt]+Mouse Wheel
Rapid Chart Scrolling when holding the ALT key. When activated, the mouse wheel scrolling speed increases by 10x (or something like that). This should work for all windows (Scanner, Order & Position Tracker, Quote Manager). To improve even more, please implement activating a window by hovering over it with the mouse. Something like this:http://www.microsoft.com/enable/trainin ... hover.aspx. Similar, except user would be required to hold the ALT key (to isolate this behavior and make it on-demand only. The ALT key will work nice together with the Rapid Scrolling). This feature will allow to navigate between charts AND scroll them instantly without a single click. (productivity. Enchancement)

• 10.1 MC_Prog requested a mouse-wheel for time-scale scrolling.
  Link: http://forum.tssupport.com/viewtopic.ph ... ouse+wheel
  Also here: http://forum.tssupport.com/viewtopic.ph ... ouse+wheel
  
  10.2 MC_Prog mentioned the "Time compression/expansion" using Mouse-wheel.(see links in #10.1)
  TrialUser asks to increase/decrease Bar-spacing with mouse wheel. The discussion goes back to 2006: http://forum.tssupport.com/viewtopic.ph ... ouse+wheel
  Later discussed: http://forum.tssupport.com/viewtopic.ph ... ouse+wheel
  May I suggest Ctrl+Alt+Mouse Wheel for Time Compression/Expansion (Bar Spacing)
  
  10.3 Janus started thread called a Better Scrolling Method. Great method - don't miss please.
  Link: http://forum.tssupport.com/viewtopic.php?t=7297&start=0
  
  10.4 John posted his ideas into thread above (see 10.3) on many aspects of scrolling charts
  
  10.5 Suggested by TJ Chart Scrolling. Link:http://forum.tssupport.com/viewtopic.php?p=32315#32315.
  Very intuitive method, although it does not incorporate scrolling chart up/down functionality as suggested by Janus method in 10.3
  
  10.6 Chart Scrolling improvement mentioned by ctrlbrk. Item C in this post: http://forum.tssupport.com/viewtopic.ph ... c&start=61

11. New Toolbar: "Sessions" with drop-down list. Can not speak about other people who trade different kinds of instruments, but for Stocks, I would like to have a quick access, and the ability to change sessions from the Toolbar. For example switch between: "24/5", "Extended hours", and "Standard hours" sessions. (Productivity. Enhancement)

12.[modified] Format Scales (Y- and X-) by Double-clicking on them. Everything else(!) on the chart is can be formatted by double-click, but Y- and X- scales behave differently. Please make it consistent (see #12.1)

• 12.1. Consider enhancing the 'Reset Y-Scale' button (on the Control Toolbar) by attaching a drop-down list to it. This is an intuitive place to reset individual data series, please include "reset all" option as well). Once it's done, consider removing the 'Reset' functionality from 'X-' and 'Y-' scales right-click menus. This will make consistent and easier for clients.
  
  12.2. Reitberg's request to reset the scale of a chart using a hotkey.
  Link: http://forum.tssupport.com/viewtopic.ph ... ght=hotkey

13. SP's Scanner suggestion to add a prompt "Format Study" when a study is added into the scanner.
link: http://forum.tssupport.com/viewtopic.php?t=7004&start=6

14. Tcat's suggestion to have the space bar as a short cut key to toggle the replay play/pause button. It would be handy. Reposted by bowlesj3: http://forum.tssupport.com/viewtopic.php?t=7004&start=3

15. Arnie's Scanner suggestion to Copy & Paste several rows in scanner using usual keyboard shortcuts.
May I also suggest the ability to select multiple rows by holding the Shift key with Arrow Up / Arrow Down keys.
link: http://forum.tssupport.com/viewtopic.php?t=7004&start=7

16. John's idea to add +1 and -1 buttons and keyboard shortcuts to adjust Playback speed here: http://forum.tssupport.com/viewtopic.ph ... 4&start=18
Also here: http://forum.tssupport.com/viewtopic.ph ... 4&start=18
May I also suggest Ctrl+Plus sign / Ctrl+Minus sign keyboard shortcuts?

17. Chart zoom. Please consider adding Ctrl+Mouse Wheel to Zoom-in and out. (just like Mozilla Firefox)

18. Arnie's suggestion to interrupt the backfill by pressing ESC button.
Link: http://forum.tssupport.com/viewtopic.ph ... 4&start=43

19. John's inquiry about Ctrl+LeftMouseButton SpaceBar+LeftMouseButton
Link:http://forum.tssupport.com/viewtopic.php?t=6449

20. AUTO TRADING SHORTCUTS
Brendanh requests to add shortcuts for the Close Position, and Do Not Close Position buttons in the Auto Trading Warning window that is displayed when you disable autotrading while in a position.
Link: http://forum.tssupport.com/viewtopic.php?t=6287&start=2
Also: http://forum.tssupport.com/viewtopic.ph ... 4&start=45
Another brendanh's thread about Automate Order Execution http://forum.tssupport.com/viewtopic.php?t=6141
Mentioned again in this post: http://forum.tssupport.com/viewtopic.ph ... 8&start=43

21. Seldom Seen requests 'Full screen' short key. Nice. http://forum.tssupport.com/viewtopic.php?t=3953

22. Add a shortcut key to force the Chart with "Link to All" option enabled to be Re-Linked to whatever window is active at the moment. Currently the chart can be re-linked only when instrument is typed into the command line... My suggestion is to use Ctrl+L

23. When drawing trend lines on the chart please allow to create straight horizontal trend lines by holding the Shift key. The same applies to ellipses and rectangles: holding the Shift key will allow to create symmetrical circles an rectangles.

24. When moving or resizing windows in the workspace please make them sticky to each other and to the boundaries of the parent window while holding the Shift key.

25. Please consider a shortcut keys for "Format Study Templates". Additionally, can you please add another Tab called "Study Templates" in the "Insert Study" dialog box?

26. Use the TAB key to quickly switch between Workspaces. Or, perhaps, make Ctrl+TAB to switch between Workspaces... so the TAB key become available for navigation in some special windows such as Scanner/Order Entry/Position Tracker.

27. Custom Hotkeys for generic tasks by vking. Link: http://forum.tssupport.com/viewtopic.php?t=6887&start=3

28. Please Add "Show Empty Periods" Button onto the "Chart Analysis Toolbar", or "Resolution Toolbar"

29. WINDOW MANAGEMENT
Old forum thread discussing GUI improvements: http://forum.tssupport.com/viewtopic.ph ... light=snap.
eSignal introduces an improved GUI - a lot of very interesting ideas. Link ScreenCast demonstrating new eSignal GUI: http://www.screencast.com/users/jayfran ... 11+Preview

30. ctrlbrk suggests shortcuts for drawing tools: http://forum.tssupport.com/viewtopic.ph ... 8&start=44

--
MULTICHARTS USERS: Please post your shortcuts & hotkeys, and I will ad them into the list. Who knows, maybe one day it's going to be implemented...

TO TSS DEVELOPERS: Please don't miss the details. They help to shape the whole picture.

I probably said this before but MC 6.0 beta 2 is great in that it never bombs on me even with my extensive use of the recalculate command (MC 2.1.999.99 bombed about once a week or every two weeks).

Pavel's ideas seem good but I need some free time on the weekend to read them again to give a more precise +1 vote on any specific ones.

Feature Idea:
TSS programmers probably have been smart enough to do this already but just incase they were too busy or rushed to think of it, here is an idea I can see many uses for in the future. Create a standard function which the TSS programmers use to execute the code that is used in MC in the playback where the bar is selected and used to decide where to start the playback. Make it such that the user can grab this date/time for any place where the user needs to enter a bar's date/time (for example into a text box but maybe not always into a text box - playback being a good example). I am thinking that the user just placees the cursor in the text box where they enter the date/time and then if they have not keyed in anything but rather they have clicked somewhere on a chart it will enter (that charts date/time from where they left mouse clicked) into the text box. They could do it again to make a correction. I had a specific place this idea could be used (and I entered this idea there) but I can't remember where that is now. So instead I just tried it for the fibonacci retrace tool I use. I put the cursor in the date/time box for that tool then tried to click o nthe chart. The problem was I am not able to see the cross hair which is used to help ensure the user has the cursor located probably before they click to select the date/time they want for that text box. This tool is not a great example since you can size it. However like I said there are other locations where MC could use this method of entering a bar's date/time into a text box (or whatever) and if this was a standard C function used by the TSS programmers they could draw on it over and over again. Of note, keeping the cross hair visible is much the same as my request to keep it visible when an arrow has been highlighted to be moved to a new location (for the many arrow drops I use as a discretionary trader to input values into my studies).

Regarding arrow drops, the more accurate you can make all types of arrows to exactly point at the top/bottom of the bar they are dropped at the better. I recently programmed one of my studies to change the arrow to a different style if a certain subchart #2 relationship was true so I get an instant visual notice of the situation. Unfortunately the new arrow format is not properly alligned as the original arrow format is and I find myself going back to try and figure out if I dropped it correctly on the bar I wanted. Depending on the situation my study at times also causes a line to go out to exactly the top/bottom of that bar and I do not need this accurate an arrow draw since the line tells me I got it correct (or not correct). However many times this line is not put out there by that study and like I said I do need to be sure it is accurate. Sometimes I zoom the chart to be sure. These kinds of time wasters can add up and help cause me to not be ready for a trade. Extra note: I just checked my standard arrow format I use and the up arrow lines up perfectly with the bar I have dropped it on, however the down arrow is off a bit. This arrow style is partly a line and it is not too hard for the eye to make the adjustment. However the arrow styles that are not a line should be reviewed more closely to ensure that the tip of the arrow is exactly pointing at the bar which they have been dropped on.

Hi.

Hey geizer, your 2 cents are the best 2 cents I ever heard

I second every one of them.

I don't know if your 7th 2 cent includes this, but when we open a chart and the data starts to be backfilled, if for some reason we decide to stop it, hitting ESC key should end that backfill.

Imagine that we request a full 1 minute month of data, but realise that the data we already have is sufficient for our purposes.
Hitting the ESC key would stop the backfill of the remaining data, leaving us with just the data we'd downloaded 'till that moment.

Regards,
Fernando

thanks Fernando,
I updated the list which now includes shortcuts suggested by others.
Quick link: http://forum.tssupport.com/viewtopic.ph ... 4&start=41

20. Brendanh's request to add shortcuts for the Close Position, and Do Not Close Position buttons in the Auto Trading Warning window that is displayed when you disable autotrading while in a position. Link: http://forum.tssupport.com/viewtopic.php?t=6287&start=2

Even more important, add a shortcut key to enable\disable autotrading itself. If there is concern that accidents will happen, make it three-key (eg Ctl-Alt-X).

Every so often (not very often) the three tool bars I have out every day are not on display and I have to bring them out again. When I make they viewable again they go back to the position I always have them set to.

Since Version 5 I have the problem to be not able to authorize my license because MC seems to connect directely to the license server. I guess before it used IE settings which worked fine for me. Because I´m using it on my office PC I really need the possibility to use a proxy or better MC uses the way like MC 2 f.e.

Thanks a lot.

Re: "Show Empty periods", Free Quotes, Daily Bars
Other Data Feeds not tested.

Ok, today I observed how dangerous the charts can be (mis)represented with "Show Empty Periods" option disabled. The Good part is - it's a Beta version! Obviously this option needs more attention from the TSS developers. This occurred with "Free Quotes" feed on the Daily bars:

There are two different ways MultiCharts displays Empty Periods on the same Chart for the same instrument. I will call them "Type 1" and "Type 2":

Type 1 - Empty periods that have no data in the database (possibly not reported by feed) These days fall on holidays and shown on charts as "void". No candles displayed on those days. The Volume histogram is "Void" as well.

Type 2 - Empty periods for which data exists in the database. The data stored as O = H = L = C = PREVIOUS CLOSE. (Probably this is how it's reported by the feed... probably). These days also fall on holidays. The candles for such empty periods Do exist on the chart. These candles look like a "dash" (obviously because O=H=L=C=PREVIOUS CLOSE). The Volume histogram for these empty periods show a 'dot' (Volume is zero) on that day.

Lets look at these scenarios:

Scenario 1: The option "Show Empty Periods" is ENABLED
looking good here...

Scenario 2: The option "Show Empty Periods" is DISABLED. Chart with ONE Instrument.
Type 1 empty periods are collapsed ( i.e. hidden )
Type 2 empty periods are NOT COLLAPSED (still visible! )
As a consequence of this the chart is compressed unevenly, and no longer accurately represents of the trading activity.

Scenario 3: Empty Periods DISABLED. Chart with TWO OR MORE Instruments.
I tested two instruments (Daily bars) on Subchart#1 and Subchart#2. Volume Histograms for both Instruments were also displayed on the same sub-charts as 2nd data series. The instruments: (1st - 'VIP' (NYSE stock), 2nd - 'APOL' (NASDAQ stock). Both Daily resolutions 3 years of data from Free Quotes. The data for 'VIP' contained both: 'Type 1', and 'Type 2', empty periods. The data for 'APOL' contained only 'Type 1' empty periods.

THE RESULT:
Sub-chart #1 - some empty periods are collapsed (Type 1), and some are displayed (Type 2).
Sub-chart #2 - all empty periods were collapsed.
The picture worth a thousand words - one must see The Chart. The right margins of both charts did not line up. MultiCharts would not reload the last few days of data. The data for one instrument was loaded untill March 26, while another (APOL) ended on 18th of March. Ctrl+R did not work. When I deleted the data from QM database, and from cache, and reloaded it again... This time the data was loaded, but only partially - MC did not load data as far back as it did before. This time the right margins on the chart did lined up. The last candle was March 31st...

Anyways, my purpose here is to just give dry facts. Hopefully this gets fixed.
---------------------------------------------------
After thoughts:
1. Is there a possibility that empty periods reported differently by yahoo, google, and msn (ex: one reports no holidays data, and another reports O=H=L=C=C[1]). What If data chunks fed by different free quotes suppliers collected and merged? .....
2. Is it possible that holidays reported differently for instruments traded on different exchanges? (in my example instruments are from two different exchanges) ? .....

--
Pavel

Hi geizer.

Have you tried to delete the holidays in QM Holidays Setup and see if there's any change?

Regards,
Fernando

arnie, my holiday list is empty. I can't even add any holidays - this option is not available I guess it's still in the Beta stage.

Can you try to reproduce the behavior I described with your datafeed? you are with IQfeed, aren't you?
If the problem I described affects other other data feeds, it will need to be addressed by TS Support.
--
pavel

Hi pavel,

Enabling or disabling Empty Periods option doesn't seem to affect IQFeed daily charts.

Maybe because I haven't yet deleted the holidays dates from QM Holidays option.

After the market closes I'll test this on my laptop since I've still have version 5.5 there.
The holidays options don't exist in version 5.5

regards,
Fernando

is wrong. Up should be green and not red. Down also the other way round. Cheers lantama

We plot what we receive from the data feed. Please type the following in your browser:
finance.google.com/finance/historical?output=csv&q=APOL&startdate=4.2.2007&enddate=3.31.2010

You will get an example containing:

19-Jan-10,60.12,60.27,59.07,60.26,3131349
---> 18-Jan-10,60.37,60.37,60.37,60.37,0
15-Jan-10,60.48,60.48,59.67,60.37,5199217
14-Jan-10,59.50,60.30,59.03,60.24,2017115
13-Jan-10,59.57,60.01,58.80,59.95,2409674
12-Jan-10,59.73,60.17,59.05,59.65,3959033
11-Jan-10,60.35,60.47,58.80,59.97,5076489
8-Jan-10,59.41,61.21,58.38,60.50,11249472
7-Jan-10,64.36,65.72,63.69,63.94,8075936
6-Jan-10,61.75,64.50,61.75,63.70,4897025
5-Jan-10,62.29,62.94,61.36,61.75,4532959
4-Jan-10,61.44,62.22,60.47,61.65,3006351
---> 1-Jan-10,60.58,60.58,60.58,60.58,0
31-Dec-09,61.03,61.57,60.58,60.58,1066910
30-Dec-09,60.80,61.81,60.45,61.22,1170463
29-Dec-09,61.68,61.70,60.77,61.02,1315290
28-Dec-09,59.54,61.81,59.20,61.63,2964075
25-Dec-09,59.27,59.27,59.27,59.27,0

You can filter such data using the holiday feature. You should assign a holiday for the exchange.




finance.yahoo doesn’t return such data O = H = L = C = PREVIOUS CLOSE)


table.finance.yahoo.com/table.csv?ignore=.csv&s=APOL&a=3&b=2&c=2007&d=2&e=31&f=2010&g=daily
2010-01-19,60.12,60.27,59.07,60.26,3131400,60.26
2010-01-15,60.48,60.48,59.67,60.37,5199300,60.37
2010-01-14,59.50,60.30,59.03,60.24,2017200,60.24
2010-01-13,59.57,60.01,58.80,59.95,2409500,59.95
2010-01-12,59.73,60.17,59.05,59.65,3955800,59.65
2010-01-11,60.35,60.47,58.80,59.97,5075300,59.97
2010-01-08,59.41,61.21,58.38,60.50,11248500,60.50
2010-01-07,64.36,65.72,63.69,63.94,8076000,63.94
2010-01-06,61.75,64.50,61.75,63.70,4897000,63.70
2010-01-05,62.29,62.94,61.36,61.75,4533000,61.75
2010-01-04,61.44,62.22,60.47,61.65,3006400,61.65
2009-12-31,61.03,61.57,60.58,60.58,1067000,60.58
2009-12-30,60.80,61.81,60.45,61.22,1170500,61.22
2009-12-29,61.68,61.70,60.77,61.02,1315300,61.02
2009-12-28,59.54,61.81,59.20,61.63,2964100,61.63
2009-12-24,58.33,59.74,58.11,59.27,726400,59.27
2009-12-23,58.03,58.50,57.90,58.44,1337200,58.44

Well, I tested using MC 5.5 and I don't see any differences with empty periods on and off

I don't know if it's a bug or it's this way be default, but it's starting to be very annoying.

Assuming this is by default, when we insert a new instrument or study, this is opened at the bottom of the chart.
Adding a second instrument or study, this will be placed below the previous inserted one.
No problem here.

The problem is when we decide to put that same instrument or study at the top of the chart.
Adding a second instrument or study, and since, by default, it goes to the bottom of the chart, MC assumes that the chart is the first study inserted, since it's below the indicator at the top, and arrange both equally, leaving the chart with the same height of the inserted study.

MC it's assuming that the chart is always at the top and this isn't always true.

Going to the format properties window and managing the subchart menu, we can view this very clearly when selecting show on top.
Automatically, the chart height assumes the default for a study and the study assumes the default of the chart only because is now at the top.

Why?
If it's a subchart, on top or bellow the chart, it should have always the default height of a subchart.

Regards,
Fernando

The order of studies on a chart (the list of them that is in format studies) is alpha order. that is why all my studies have A_whatever or A_Z_whatever, so I can control that for macros which go in and turn the top one off then on again.

I wish there was a set of keys we could define to set the exact subchart sizes on all charts (all charts changes with one key stroke). Now that would be really useful. So all this default stuff would be of no concern. Now if the shortcut was for a main chart and 1 subchart and the user added a 3rd chart without changing the shortcut then it would simply bypass that chart or maybe give a popup warning. It would be up to the user to change the shortcut to get rid of the worning. What is very annoying is when you turn a study off and on again and it keeps changing its subchart location (sometimes creating a new subchart at the bottom for it). I have not figured out why it sometimes does this and at other times does not.

Well, I tested using MC 5.5 and I don't see any differences with empty periods on and off

Arnie,
I have noticed empty periods are not displayed with single instrument on the chart. With two instruments on the chart, (each on its own sub-chart) "Show Empty Periods" seem to work. I only have access to free quotes at the moment. Don't know if this is specific to free quotes or also true for other feeds... Can you test to see if this is the case with IQfeed?
Thank you,
Pavel

edited after
Apparently this thread explains the behavior:
http://forum.tssupport.com/viewtopic.ph ... light=gaps
According to Andrew this is an 'architectural' and done on purpose. Not sure if holidays were taken into consideration at a time...

and more on the subject:
http://forum.tssupport.com/viewtopic.ph ... ty+periods

http://forum.tssupport.com/viewtopic.ph ... ty+periods

The discussion goes back to 2007
http://forum.tssupport.com/viewtopic.ph ... ty+periods

edited
searched the forum. there are far too many references to this issue. Apparently TS Support is well aware of it...
--

You can filter such data using the holiday feature. You should assign a holiday for the exchange.

Thank you for help Andrew

The difference between how holiday data reported by yahoo and google clears the situation. Also I looked back into "Show empty periods" discussion, and see this is far more complex than it looked at first. I have some ideas (hopefully viable), which I need to give some more time. Will take few days, or couple of weeks and communicate it back, once I put them on a paper.
--
Pavel

Hi.

When dealing with a multiple monitor system, QM and PLE act differently when opened.

QM always opens on the monitor on which it was last used, whereas PLE opens on the first monitor.

PLE should open also on the monitor last used.

Regards,
Fernando

From time to time, due to some problem with the computer I'm forced to reset it or close all programs and reopen them again.

When this happens, and I reopen MC, I receive a warning indicating that another version of it is open on another computer.

If the DRM servers have some sort of delay when connecting, disconnecting, and reconnecting the same licence again, can this be a reason for that warning to pop up?


Regards,
Fernando

Some things on my short list excluding the "elephant in the room" of a DOM+Chart Trading:

a) Add a Transparent color option for plots. Invisible plots are not sufficient, see this post.

b) Allow more than one custom fitness to exist simultaneously, like a drop-down list.

c) Improve chart scrolling. This is major. A long discussion on this already, but I'd also like to be able to "grab" the chart with left-click and drag the chart left or right with the mouse. I am not talking about scaling, I am talking about scrolling.

d) Add option to maintain the right-margin during chart scrolling. I really dislike my margin going away when I scroll backwards, but it should be toggle on/off.

Mike

This happened two times within a short period (maybe a total of an hour and a half of use). I am a new MC user and experienced TS user. TS 8.7 was running (however quite idle) while this happened both times.

The problem: During a genetic optimization, I clicked the cancel button. The platform froze for about 10 seconds both times, then closed each time. All unsaved work was lost.

Thanks for reading.

Please think about a new feature:
Multi-Order (= allow trading on data2, not only signal from data2)

I believe the whole issue of being able to trade multiple series is something that's been discussed a good bit including in this support forum, and is already contemplated for the future - I just haven't heard there's an ETA for this yet. This is important, obviously, for certain classes of systems such as pairs trading or for trading a single system on a portfolio of instruments, where the single system needs to be aware of all positions. While work-arounds are possible (GV, ADE, etc.) they're generally cumbersome and prone to error because of complex sequencing/timing and other issues.

I agree on the data2 trading. There are probably two camps here -- camp 1 are algo traders who don't care about a DOM and discretionary trading, and who would really like to see the ability to submit traders to a data2 timeframe. Then there are camp 2, who are discretionary traders using two platforms and really want to eliminate the non-MultiCharts platform, and thus really want the DOM and Chart Trading badly.

I do both, but since there is already a workaround (GV) for the submitting to data2, my personal preference would be for the discretionary trading options to remain the #1 priority. Perhaps if 6.5 or 7.0 contain the DOM, then it isn't too unreasonable to hope that the next .5 release can add the ability to submit orders to an additional dataseries

Also, someone on my forum mentioned they were told by TSSupport the next release might be 6.5 (not 7). Is there a post about this somewhere here on the forum? I am wondering if discretionary is being add to 6.5, or if 6.5 is being released without discretionary trading.

Mike

I agree on the data2 trading. There are probably two camps here -- camp 1 are algo traders who don't care about a DOM and discretionary trading, and who would really like to see the ability to submit traders to a data2 timeframe. Then there are camp 2, who are discretionary traders using two platforms and really want to eliminate the non-MultiCharts platform, and thus really want the DOM and Chart Trading badly.

I do both, but since there is already a workaround (GV) for the submitting to data2, my personal preference would be for the discretionary trading options to remain the #1 priority. Perhaps if 6.5 or 7.0 contain the DOM, then it isn't too unreasonable to hope that the next .5 release can add the ability to submit orders to an additional dataseries

Also, someone on my forum mentioned they were told by TSSupport the next release might be 6.5 (not 7). Is there a post about this somewhere here on the forum? I am wondering if discretionary is being add to 6.5, or if 6.5 is being released without discretionary trading.

Mike

* Last I heard, Andrew said that beta3 was due out, about a week ago, I think, so anytime. That should be the next version released.

While work-arounds are possible (GV, ADE, etc.) they're generally cumbersome and prone to error because of complex sequencing/timing and other issues.

It's really so complex to program this feature?
I thought it must be added only the order commands data2, for example

buy xxx xxx xxx data2;

like signalcodes

var1 = currentask data2.

Mh. This feature, MultiInstrument-Orders, would very very nice for me
In NT I use multi-instrument-orders in a strategy at time, but I don't like NT, MC is greater

I am wondering if discretionary is being add to 6.5, or if 6.5 is being released without discretionary trading.

Discretionary is scheduled for an unspecified time in summer. So I think this feature will be added earliest in 7.

I just want to make sure this bug is well known by TSS:

After defining a custom fitness, the code is lost at some time in the future.

Steps to reproduce:
Edit custom fitness
Create code
Use MultiCharts on a daily basis

At some point, the custom fitness code is gone. I haven't been able to narrow down when exactly because I haven't paid close enough attention, but I do know that I "Saved workspace" and it made no difference.

It seems this is a underutilized feature of MultiCharts, but it is a crucial one to optimizing, so please fix it so I don't have to keep re-coding the fitness code.

Thx,
Mike

Dear Mike,
We failed to reproduce the issue. Could you illustrate all steps we must take to reproduce the issue?

Andrew,

Using MC 6.0 beta 2. I've added the Custom Fitness code in the Format Signals - Optimize box, Algorithm-specific, custom criteria - Edit.

When I exit MultiCharts and reload, the custom fitness code is gone. This has happened to me twice, I'm sorry I can't be more specific. Does this C code exist in a file somewhere? Is it in some database somewhere? Maybe I can go look at the file directly.

I do know I used "save workspace" and it still happened. Is Save Workspace required to save this custom fitness code?

Is a clean-shutdown of MC required for it to be saved, or is it saved as soon as you exit the screen? I do remember MC crashed on me a couple of times during large optimizations, but I didn't exactly go straight into the custom fitness code after re-loading MC to see if that is when it was missing or not.

Overall, I really kindly ask you improve this area of MultiCharts for the next release. Being able to only have ONE custom fitness is very limiting, I really would like to see a drop-down box with all the custom fitness I create, like NT. Maybe during this code change the problem I am experiencing will also go away.

Thx,
Mike

While work-arounds are possible (GV, ADE, etc.) they're generally cumbersome and prone to error because of complex sequencing/timing and other issues.

Just while we are on the subject of sequencing I would like to see millisecond time stamps so that indicators behave the same on historical data as live data. This is particularly important when using multiple data streams or bid ask and last data to construct MD type indicators. I think this is probably the main reason that IRT is doing so well.... the popularity of indicators that need volume@bid vs. volume@ask.

Even with millisecond time stamping indicators need to calculate from start to finish before another tick is processed (even if it is in another data stream). As things stand now race conditions can occur with multiple data streams. Precision is important for certain types of work.

I have sent emails to support on this subject but thought it might be appropriate to mention here.

Proper sequencing and processing across multiple data streams (both live and historical) is crucial to any modern charting/analysis software.

...volume@bid vs. volume@ask...

Well, and you may not realize yet that there's no historical storage of bid or ask prices either, but you would need that if you want to conduct historical testing of this.

...volume@bid vs. volume@ask...

Well, and you may not realize yet that there's no historical storage of bid or ask prices either, but you would need that if you want to conduct historical testing of this.

In QuoteManager "Fields to Collect" there are bid/ask/last, what is the bid/ask for if it isn't being stored? I figured "collected" meant "stored".

Mike

My mistake in the incautious way that was phrased. In EasyLanguage, CurrentAsk and CurrentBid are defined separately from Close only in real-time (and I was speaking of historical testing above), so if you want to analyze historical bid/ask you would need to make them their own data series and choose in the symbol setup to base the symbol on bid or ask rather than trades. However, this would align such bars only by second timestamp, so it would not probably be accurate in the way the poster here looking for MD type analysis is envisioning.

My mistake in the incautious way that was phrased. In EasyLanguage, CurrentAsk and CurrentBid are defined separately from Close only in real-time (and I was speaking of historical testing above), so if you want to analyze historical bid/ask you would need to make them their own data series and choose in the symbol setup to base the symbol on bid or ask rather than trades. However, this would align such bars only by second timestamp, so it would not probably be accurate in the way the poster here looking for MD type analysis is envisioning.

Thx for the detailed response Bruce.

So, if I have:
data1 = last
data2 = bid
data3 = ask

Then I can have correctly-aligned bid/ask data matching/synchronized with the last, yes? I just can't use CurrentBid or CurrentAsk keywords on a historical chart, but I can use 'Close' of data2 and 'Close' of data3 for the same, right?

Mike

In theory, that type of approach "works" provided you understand that aligned means by the time stamps, and the time stamps only have a 1 second resolution. So, if the bid/ask/trade prices fluctuate all over the map within a given second, the assignment of those trades to a particular bid/ask side is somewhat arbitrary in this scenario.

In other words, the trade/bid/ask data is kept in a sequence in QuoteManager, but the charting engine is written in a general way and doesn't know you've put different aspects of the same tick stream on the chart - all it knows is it has several tick series, and that it has to align tick series based on their second time stamps.

This is an area that I suspect could be improved significantly in the future. EasyLanguage wasn't really designed for this kind of analysis, although MultiCharts has come a really long way relative to what TS does at least as of today.

I like this feature in MT:
open chart - click left and hold => move mouse to another point in chart

now the mouse count pips and bars.

so you can see fast how many pips and bars between 2 points are.

This thread should move to a new feedback thread, as beta 3 is available for download today.