MC DT FeedBack

Questions about MultiCharts and user contributed studies.
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arnie
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MC DT FeedBack

Postby arnie » 02 Feb 2011

Hi Dave.

Does this means that MC 7 is stable enough for a beta released?

Regards,
Fernando

PS: as I reported on the MC DT forum, I just can't connect this version to IB.
Let's see if with the beta version things will be more clear.

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Re: MultiCharts Discretionary Trader

Postby Dave Masalov » 02 Feb 2011

Dear Fernando,

MC 7 Beta is planned to be released in the end of this month as we plan to add some important features to it.

PS: as I reported on the MC DT forum, I just can't connect this version to IB.
Let's see if with the beta version things will be more clear.


Please come to our Live Chat between 6:30AM and 2PM EST so we can connect to your computer remotely and help you.

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Re: MultiCharts Discretionary Trader

Postby SP » 02 Feb 2011

- Bracket Orders still visible: If the oder didnt get filled and you cancel the order, the Brackets are still visible in the DOM and didnt cancel.
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Re: MultiCharts Discretionary Trader

Postby Dave Masalov » 03 Feb 2011

Dear SP,

Please send us the screenshot of your Order and Position Tracker --> Orders tab as well as your log files. You can find log files here:

WinXP
"%USERPROFILE%\Local Settings\Application Data\TS Support\MultiCharts\"
VISTA, W7
"%USERPROFILE%\Local\TS Support\MultiCharts\"

You should paste this line in Start --> Run and in the window that will pop up make a zip-folder.

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Re: MultiCharts Discretionary Trader

Postby iso » 03 Feb 2011

I noticed when you have the volume study on the chart and go into Format Study / Scaling / Divide Scale Labels and check Auto it doesn't seem to work...

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Re: MultiCharts Discretionary Trader

Postby Dave Masalov » 04 Feb 2011

Dear iso,

This issue is already in our fix list. Thank you for reporting.

https://www.multicharts.com/pm/viewissue ... _no=MC-165

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Re: MultiCharts Discretionary Trader

Postby Dave Masalov » 04 Feb 2011

- Bracket Orders still visible: If the oder didnt get filled and you cancel the order, the Brackets are still visible in the DOM and didnt cancel.

Dear SP,

The issue has been confirmed and added to our fix list: https://www.multicharts.com/pm/viewissue ... _no=MC-166

Thank you for reporting.

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Re: MultiCharts Discretionary Trader

Postby iso » 04 Feb 2011

I noticed that the order lines aren't long enough, they hide the most recent bars. It seems that the lines should be extended further to the left and maybe the option to make the text transparent.

Kevin

Re: MC DT FeedBack

Postby Kevin » 08 Feb 2011

A Right Click on the DOM brings up a list of options (Stop, Stop w/Limit etc.) whereas a Left Click immediately submits a Limit order.

Is this configurable so that a Right Click will immediately submit an order rather than having to select from a list?

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Re: MC DT FeedBack

Postby geizer » 09 Feb 2011

If this is the place for Pre-Alpha feedback then I would like to give some thoughts on the new functionality:

Overall I am impressed with the direction taken. Love the new Order Panel inside the chart window. Perfect location, and extremely efficient use of space.

Regarding Trade Bar I am somewhat reserved to comment as it seems to implement a lot of redundant functionality. If I don't see benefits of Trade Bar, maybe it's since I don't see myself placing orders through multiple brokers.

There have been some comments regarding new icons. I can get used to any icons, however, may I suggest using different icon sets for Multicharts full and Discretionary versions (I'm talking about application icons, not toolbar icons). This would make both versions distictive from each other and remove possible confusion when icons placed on desktop.

Now specific suggestions after some extensive pre-alpha testing over couple of days:

Chart Trader:
1. When left mouse is clicked on the Stop loss order, the tag always display the distance in $ from the Bid (or Ask) price, regardless of how distance selected by user to be displayed in PL/open position tag. There are couple of notes I would like to make: a) Displaying the distance from the actual open position (rather than from the last trade) makes more sence. b) Stop loss distance should always be displayed in the same way the PL is displayed. Example: if PL displayed in % then the Stop loss should also display %. If PL shows pips then stop loss should be showing pips as well. The same applies to how the distance to Profit target is displayed.

2. I would also like to have an option to see the distance displayed in R-multiples as well. Example: if the StopLoss order = 10 pips, and Profit Target order = 25 pips, then R multiple ("R") = 1/(Risk/Reward) = 1/(10/25)=2.5. Please consider adding R. The PL will also display profit or loss in R-multiples. For instance if I have opened a long position at $5 and my stop is $4.75, while the market is trading at $5.05 then PL will show profit of R= +0.2 (R=1/( ($5.00 -$4.75)/($5.05-5.00))

While I am in the same position and market is trading at $4.90 then:
PL should show a loss of R= -0.4 (R=1/( ($5.00 -$4.75)/($4.90-5.00))

When market hits my Stop, the PL =-1.0R, which means I was wrong and the market was right (or my stop was too tight). My goal is to achieve winning trades to have PL much greater than +1.0 R and my losing trades be less and never greater than 1R. This way I can have more losing trades and still be profitable. That's the concept. if you need to get more familiar with R-multiples please read this).
I will also try to give my own main reason why displaying R is very important. I would rather not see the scoreboard (PL) in dollars. Thinking in R-multiples takes money out of the equation. Money is emotion, and less emotion in trading means better performance. Second, thinking in terms of R-multiples helps to keep focus on managing the risk, and not thinking about imaginary profits.
So these are my reasons why R is very important. Since you have come that close, I think that implementing the R is as easy as pips, $, or percentages which already implemented. Please provide an option to see R as well.

Chart order panel:
I played with some ideas using copy & paste and came up with suggestions shown on the picture below. It's self-explanatory, but I should make couple of comments:

Basically the picture shows two main ideas:
1. Integration of Command line functionality right into the Order Panel to allow immediate access. The reason is simple: The side order panel integrates so well into the interface that it's logical to a do everything form this "dashboard". On multi-monitor set-ups this will make everything handy without the need to go and look for that toolbar on the monitor #n.

2. Please consider displaying Bid, Ask, and Last prices next to Buy/Sell/Market Buy & Sell buttons to make information available immediately and intuitive. Here again the word dashboard comes to mind. The color of Last Price changes according with Up/Down tick, some examples are provided. Trying to stretch the idea even futher, little tick arrows can be used also to display the dynamics of Bid and Ask.Image
P.S. I was seriously sidetracked by failure of the motherboard on my PC, but hopefully my comments aren't coming too late to consider implementing them.
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Suggested Modifications to order panel
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Re: MC DT FeedBack

Postby arnie » 10 Feb 2011

geizer wrote:Basically the picture shows two main ideas:
1. Integration of Command line functionality right into the Order Panel to allow immediate access. The reason is simple: The side order panel integrates so well into the interface that it's logical to a do everything form this "dashboard". On multi-monitor set-ups this will make everything handy without the need to go and look for that toolbar on the monitor #n.

2. Please consider displaying Bid, Ask, and Last prices next to Buy/Sell/Market Buy & Sell buttons to make information available immediately and intuitive. Here again the word dashboard comes to mind. The color of Last Price changes according with Up/Down tick, some examples are provided. Trying to stretch the idea even futher, little tick arrows can be used also to display the dynamics of Bid and Ask.


Hi geizer.

+1

Liked the idea of having the command line in the chart order panel.

Also, when dealing with a setup of multiple monitors, each chart should have it's own drawing tool. It's quite painful to move your mouse between 4 screens to reach the drawing tool so you can select a trendline or text.
Notice that the drawing tool should have an hide option so it won't remove chart visible space.

Adding the bid/ask in the chart order panel is a must have.
I don't use IB for datafeed so there are times where we can see come discrepancies between IB's bid/ask prices and eSignal's prices and we need to take that in consideration when triggering a setup.

There's a problem with this alpha version that affects those who use a datafeed external from the broker.
Orders given by the chart order panel only work one way, meaning, when we give an order through IB, for example, on an eSignal chart, we cannot see the order itself on the chart nor on the chart order panel. Only through the position tracker window we have access to the orders given.

This is a problem that can ruin a trader's plan when considering MC for his trading platform.
Dave said this will be fixed during the beta stage or in the final MC 7 version.
I'm crossing my fingers...

Regards

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Re: MC DT FeedBack

Postby Tresor » 10 Feb 2011

arnie wrote:
Liked the idea of having the command line in the chart order panel.

Also, when dealing with a setup of multiple monitors, each chart should have it's own drawing tool. It's quite painful to move your mouse between 4 screens to reach the drawing tool so you can select a trendline or text.


I would argue that having separate drawing tools for each chart is not a best solution, in terms of space economics. What if you have 3 charts on each of your your 4 monitors? - that gives 12 drawing tools while in fact you need only 4!

It would be better to have separate drawing tools for each monitor (each sub-workspace) rather than separate drawing tools for each chart.

Explained here: viewtopic.php?p=32245

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Re: MC DT FeedBack

Postby arnie » 10 Feb 2011

Tresor wrote:I would argue that having separate drawing tools for each chart is not a best solution, in terms of space economics. What if you have 3 charts on each of your your 4 monitors? - that gives 12 drawing tools while in fact you need only 4!

It would be better to have separate drawing tools for each monitor (each sub-workspace) rather than separate drawing tools for each chart.

Explained here: viewtopic.php?p=32245


I'm a bit lost with your 12 drawing tool.

I was thinking on something like the chart below. I already made a request for this feature.

This is something similar to the new eSignal 11, where they have a drawing tool for each chart. This tool is hide, and only visible when you put the mouse on the window header.
This way, with 4 charts you have only 4 drawing tools, 1 per chart.

Your sub-workspace is also interesting, but since TSsuport made a order panel per chart, I think it is also preferable to made a drawing tool also per chart.


Image

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Re: MC DT FeedBack

Postby Tresor » 10 Feb 2011

arnie wrote:I'm a bit lost with your 12 drawing tool.


That's easy. If you have 4 small monitors, then you can have 1 chart per one monitor. Therefore you get 4 drawing tools in your multi-monitor set-up.

If you have 4 big monitors and you decide to have 3 charts per monitor, you end up with 12 drawing tools.

That's a waste of real estate (pixels) to have as many as 12 drawing tools!

arnie wrote:I was thinking on something like the chart below.


And I was thinking of something like this: download/file.php?id=2648

arnie wrote:I already made a request for this feature.


Your solution is very good for traders with multiple small monitors.

My solution is targeted for multiple monitor users who have high res displays. I have recently bought 3 monitors of 2560x1440 each (unfortunately lying idle in boxes) and intend to have 3 charts per one monitor.

arnie wrote:Your sub-workspace is also interesting, but since TSsuport made a order panel per chart, I think it is also preferable to made a drawing tool also per chart.


It will be interesting to see what progression is to be made in favour of discretionary traders (of the three described below) by MC in the development of the platform (in case there will be any development in this field):

(i) the platform has a trade panel for each separate chart, therefore MC might evolve into a platform that has drawing tools separate for each chart, in line with your feature request.

(ii) MC also has a trade bar dedicated to a workspace, therefore if 'trade bar' logic is to prevail, you would expect that one set of drawing tools will remain dedicated to a workspace, as it is today.

(iii) MC might come up with a 'sub-workspace' concept that will satisfy any type of multiple monitor trader thus gaining advantage over any other platfom :P

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Re: MC DT FeedBack

Postby arnie » 10 Feb 2011

Only for small monitors? I don't see things that way. It is useful for small and big screens. You can have big screens and only 1 chart in each one of them.

Your sub-workspace is more a detachable workspace.
I can see the advantages of having 1 order panel and 1 set of tools per workspace, but then again, we would have the same problem. You would need to make too many mouse movements to reached a tool every time one would be requested.

The problem here is only one, the mouse movements. For fast thinking, drawing, markets movement, you cannot be wasting time moving your mouse through out the workspace or multiple monitors as if you were walking your dog at the city park. You need all basic tools right there at your side.

The bigger the monitor the bigger distance your mouse need to walk.

Needless to say that part of this problem could be resolved with keyboard shortcuts, something that as far as I remember, has been requested since version 5, and apparently, at least I haven't seen it mentioned anywhere, it will not see daylight in the upcoming version 7 :(

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Re: MC DT FeedBack

Postby SP » 10 Feb 2011

On Alpha3 the Bid Ask quotes (with Interactive) disappear if you check "Dynamic Price Scale" and you move the mouse over the DOM window. A message "Auto-Recentering Suspended" shows up.
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Re: MC DT FeedBack

Postby Tresor » 10 Feb 2011

arnie wrote:Your sub-workspace is more a detachable workspace.


It is non-detachable. That's the beauty of it.

arnie wrote:I can see the advantages of having 1 order panel and 1 set of tools per workspace, but then again, we would have the same problem.


THE CATCH IS I WISH TO HAVE MULTIPLE ORDER PANELS AND MULTIPLE DRAWING TOOLS PER 1 WORKSPACE.

arnie wrote:You would need to make too many mouse movements to reached a tool every time one would be requested.


Not with the concept of 'sub-workspaces'.

arnie wrote:The problem here is only one, the mouse movements. For fast thinking, drawing, markets movement, you cannot be wasting time moving your mouse through out the workspace or multiple monitors as if you were walking your dog at the city park. You need all basic tools right there at your side.


The concept of 'sub-workspace' will solve not only the mouse movement problem mentioned by you but it will also solve other issues :)

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Re: MC DT FeedBack

Postby geizer » 10 Feb 2011

Tresor, Arnie,

Your suggestions are valuable. The best approach imho is to take some time, and create the paper trail by submitting the feature requests via project management. I will definitely submit my comments made in this thread as a feature request along with the reason why I think these are important, as soon as I have some time.
I encourage you to do the same.
Cheers,

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Re: MC DT FeedBack

Postby MotoMoto » 10 Feb 2011

Yes- I am having the same IB problems.... however, interestingly enough, for some reason I could actually start to see the orders, be shown on the screen with the chart tags in MC, and then an order being put into IB..... but only briefly - hence the systems are connected.....
I never noticed this before, but managed to get a glimpse (possibly when the computer slowed down)

I second the ideas of geizer.

Also as a suggestion...... when dragging and dropping the Place Order strategies from the order panel on the right hand side of a chart, while not essential as you can be accurate in placing it at the desired price level, a dotted line for the relevant price might be handy to show exactly where the order will be placed.
As well, once the tags are on the chart, rather than a dotted line from the tag showing the order to the chart axis on the right hand side, possbilly the tag should be up against the axis, and the dotted line from the tag could carry over into the chart prices.....so the dotted line comes out of the left hand side of the order tag and can be easily matched up with the chart price levels.
(my two cents so far) thanks.

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Re: MC DT FeedBack

Postby geizer » 10 Feb 2011

MotoMoto wrote:
Also as a suggestion...... when dragging and dropping the Place Order strategies from the order panel on the right hand side of a chart, while not essential as you can be accurate in placing it at the desired price level, a dotted line for the relevant price might be handy to show exactly where the order will be placed.
I just drop the order at a safe distance from the market, and then move it to precise price level.

As well, once the tags are on the chart, rather than a dotted line from the tag showing the order to the chart axis on the right hand side, possbilly the tag should be up against the axis, and the dotted line from the tag could carry over into the chart prices.....so the dotted line comes out of the left hand side of the order tag and can be easily matched up with the chart price levels.
(my two cents so far) thanks.
+1
This is precisely what I've been thinking about, This is as if you read my mind. Hopefully developers can give it some serious consideration.

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Re: MC DT FeedBack

Postby TIKITRADER » 13 Feb 2011

geizer... your ideas on the order panel are great.

In addition to your suggestions also to add tabs for the the selections and utilize the space even greater.
If the possibility of T&S entered this could also work in this very usable space.
see image



Image
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Re: MC DT FeedBack

Postby reptile » 09 Mar 2011

geizer wrote:Please provide an option to see R as well.

http://www.trackntrade.com/stocks/

Look at bookmark Features on site. I am sugesting to test demo of this paltform (it's very nice & near to MC). TnT have many tools and ideas for RR.

Guest

Re: MC DT FeedBack

Postby Guest » 15 Apr 2011

Kevin wrote:A Right Click on the DOM brings up a list of options (Stop, Stop w/Limit etc.) whereas a Left Click immediately submits a Limit order.

Is this configurable so that a Right Click will immediately submit an order rather than having to select from a list?


Has this issue been addressed?

TonyB

Re: MC DT FeedBack

Postby TonyB » 20 Apr 2011

Using MCDT + OEC, and both myself and friend have experienced the same issue.

We have noticed that we can trade just fine, from the chart or DOM. We then decide to close MCDT.

After a while, we re-open it and for some reason we are unable to take a position. This is even so with mkt orders. We are asked for confirmation (that option is selected), do so, yet no position is taken - apparently. I say that because after reopening MC a little later, we see (both of us), outstanding positions that were not there previously, or at least visible. It seems that orders were being taken, just not showing-up in the DOM, on the chart or in the New Order and Positions Tracking window...

Has anyone else experienced this oddity?

Later after re-opening MCDT, order entry works, meaning that we can see the orders and positions...

Note, this was experienced with MCDT Beta 1 and now with 7.0 Beta 2 (Build 43).

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Re: MC DT FeedBack

Postby Stan Bokov » 21 Apr 2011

Guest wrote:
Kevin wrote:A Right Click on the DOM brings up a list of options (Stop, Stop w/Limit etc.) whereas a Left Click immediately submits a Limit order.

Is this configurable so that a Right Click will immediately submit an order rather than having to select from a list?


Has this issue been addressed?


No, the right-click is still not configurable. It is not currently planned to change this behavior.

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Re: MC DT FeedBack

Postby Stan Bokov » 21 Apr 2011

arnie wrote:There's a problem with this alpha version that affects those who use a datafeed external from the broker.
Orders given by the chart order panel only work one way, meaning, when we give an order through IB, for example, on an eSignal chart, we cannot see the order itself on the chart nor on the chart order panel. Only through the position tracker window we have access to the orders given.

This is a problem that can ruin a trader's plan when considering MC for his trading platform.
Dave said this will be fixed during the beta stage or in the final MC 7 version.
I'm crossing my fingers...

Regards


For all those reading this forum, this has been addressed here - viewtopic.php?f=1&t=8465&p=39632&hilit=one+way+mapping+two+way+mapping#p39632

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Re: MC DT FeedBack

Postby Stan Bokov » 21 Apr 2011

TonyB wrote:Using MCDT + OEC, and both myself and friend have experienced the same issue.

We have noticed that we can trade just fine, from the chart or DOM. We then decide to close MCDT.

After a while, we re-open it and for some reason we are unable to take a position. This is even so with mkt orders. We are asked for confirmation (that option is selected), do so, yet no position is taken - apparently. I say that because after reopening MC a little later, we see (both of us), outstanding positions that were not there previously, or at least visible. It seems that orders were being taken, just not showing-up in the DOM, on the chart or in the New Order and Positions Tracking window...

Has anyone else experienced this oddity?

Later after re-opening MCDT, order entry works, meaning that we can see the orders and positions...

Note, this was experienced with MCDT Beta 1 and now with 7.0 Beta 2 (Build 43).


This issue has been documented in Beta 2 and fixed in Beta 3 - if you reopened MCDT while some processes were hanging, it would still be capable of actively sending orders and taking positions while not reflecting any of this graphically. This gave the impression of 'ghost' orders that 'were not' initiated. Beta 3 should be available in 12 hours.

TonyB

Re: MC DT FeedBack

Postby TonyB » 24 Apr 2011

Stan Bokov wrote:
TonyB wrote:Using MCDT + OEC, and both myself and friend have experienced the same issue.

We have noticed that we can trade just fine, from the chart or DOM. We then decide to close MCDT.

After a while, we re-open it and for some reason we are unable to take a position. This is even so with mkt orders. We are asked for confirmation (that option is selected), do so, yet no position is taken - apparently. I say that because after reopening MC a little later, we see (both of us), outstanding positions that were not there previously, or at least visible. It seems that orders were being taken, just not showing-up in the DOM, on the chart or in the New Order and Positions Tracking window...

Has anyone else experienced this oddity?

Later after re-opening MCDT, order entry works, meaning that we can see the orders and positions...

Note, this was experienced with MCDT Beta 1 and now with 7.0 Beta 2 (Build 43).


This issue has been documented in Beta 2 and fixed in Beta 3 - if you reopened MCDT while some processes were hanging, it would still be capable of actively sending orders and taking positions while not reflecting any of this graphically. This gave the impression of 'ghost' orders that 'were not' initiated. Beta 3 should be available in 12 hours.


Thank you Stan, good to hear.

Maybe due to the long weekend, but I went to go download Beta 3, and still see Beta 2:

Install

Edition: MultiCharts Discretionary Trader
Version: 7.0.43.202 Beta 2
Release Date: 15 April 2011
File Size: 48.1 MB

Is there a way to get an email notice when newer versions become available?

Second question (and last)... Is there a better / easier way to download as opposed to going to the download page an completing those fields for name, email address, phone number again? No big deal, but just wondering...

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Re: MC DT FeedBack

Postby Stan Bokov » 25 Apr 2011

In the future there will be notices, just not now since it's in beta testing. Also, right now is to keep filling out the form. In the future - this won't be an issue since updates won't come out that often.

Guest

Re: MC DT FeedBack

Postby Guest » 25 Apr 2011

Stan Bokov wrote:In the future there will be notices, just not now since it's in beta testing. Also, right now is to keep filling out the form. In the future - this won't be an issue since updates won't come out that often.


Thank you Stan.

I see that MCDT is still Beta 2 from April 15. When do you expect Beta 3 MCDT to be made available? I'm guessing soon since you thought within a few hours last week. Thank you.

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Re: MC DT FeedBack

Postby Stan Bokov » 26 Apr 2011

Beta 3 should be posted soon - you should check the blog, Facebook and/or Twitter to see latest updates.

TonyB

Re: MC DT FeedBack

Postby TonyB » 26 Apr 2011

I'll check the blog regularly as that's better / faster than inputting info on the download page. Thank you.


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