Master Strategy : difficult to master

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StratMan
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Master Strategy : difficult to master

Postby StratMan » 26 Jan 2012

Suppose your broker is FXCM and you want to use Master Strategy.

For example, you enter a limit order, you confirm and it appears on your chart.
Then you click this order to attach a Master Strategy.
Suppose you want to get out in 3 steps, so you enter 3 target prices, 3 stop loss prices and 3 position sizes.

After validation, your trading plan appears on the chart:
Your entry, already mentioned, and, transparent display, the 3 targets and 3 stop loss.

When the price reaches your entry price, then your order will be executed and your Master Strategy is validated: your stop loss and targets will then appear perfectly on the chart, via transparent display mode to standard display mode. They will be properly executed according to price action.
That's what is planned, expected, hoped for ... and runs from time to time ...

In practice, Master Strategy will randomly turn into a Bracket Strategy, using the first target price and the first stop loss price for the full open position ...

Master Strategy thinks he's the master and decides unilaterally to change your trading plan! :-)

A "patch" would be to increase the time between two orders, which is currently set to 1 sec on ​​my MC ... It is clear that I do not consider the HFT with MC but can be annoying to double or triple the time between orders ... without being certain that this problem would be solved!

Question 1:
In your opinion, this random behavior is it an anomaly to be corrected or do you think this is only a detail unnecessary to correct ?

Question 2:
Who you are using FXCM and Master Strategy, what delay value you use to prevent this execution?

Question 3:
If you use Master Strategy without noticing this problem, so what forex broker you use?

Thanks in advance,

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Andrew MultiCharts
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Re: Master Strategy : difficult to master

Postby Andrew MultiCharts » 31 Jan 2012

Hello again Christian,

Just wanted to add few words (as we have previously discussed) that it's not happing randomly.

Current realization:
Master Strategy placement depends on open market position amount of contracts, not to original entry order quantity. That is why it is important for the entry order consisting of 3 contracts to be filled at once and not partially. Because if first contract is filled and before that micro time period ends, no new contracts are filled, then Master Strategy places exit orders depending on the amount of filled contracts.

Workarounds:
If your first level of stop orders is far enough from entry price, so you can wait 1, 2 or even 3 seconds before next level of stop orders is placed, then it may be an easy way to prevent such behaviour by inserting artificial delay.

Also, since Master Strategy placement is bound to open position, you may want to try a different broker, that would fill all your orders at once (it mainly depends on the broker and market). But again, the key point is speed of execution of your entry order.

manualtrader
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Re: Master Strategy : difficult to master

Postby manualtrader » 01 Feb 2012

StratMan wrote:Suppose your broker is FXCM and you want to use Master Strategy.


In practice, Master Strategy will randomly turn into a Bracket Strategy, using the first target price and the first stop loss price for the full open position ...

Master Strategy thinks he's the master and decides unilaterally to change your trading plan! :-)

A "patch" would be to increase the time between two orders, which is currently set to 1 sec on ​​my MC ... It is clear that I do not consider the HFT with MC but can be annoying to double or triple the time between orders ... without being certain that this problem would be solved!

Question 1:
In your opinion, this random behavior is it an anomaly to be corrected or do you think this is only a detail unnecessary to correct ?

Question 2:
Who you are using FXCM and Master Strategy, what delay value you use to prevent this execution?

Question 3:
If you use Master Strategy without noticing this problem, so what forex broker you use?

Thanks in advance,


There are lots of problems when you use more of the Master Strategy. viewtopic.php?f=1&t=9760
I don't know why MC doesn't want to fix it, it looks very simple, because NT and SC all did very well in this area. Probably not many users complained about this, or possible not that many people use MC because the difficulties. We love MC, but we hope it better to help trade, not just fancy looking.

StratMan
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Re: Master Strategy : difficult to master

Postby StratMan » 01 Feb 2012

Hello manualtrader,

Thank you for your response.
I note that we are at least 2 having tried to trade manually with Master Strategy MC ;-)
I also noticed that NT did not have this bad behavior.
The output with Master Strategy is just unusable, and since all my strategies are using exits in 3 steps, so I have to go back to my initials platforms ...

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Re: Master Strategy : difficult to master

Postby vking » 01 Feb 2012

Unfortunately - autotrading with MC is not smooth either - due to limitations of power language :( and MC's point of view - they leave it as a feature rather than addressing them or providing a work around.

I like charting/controls much in MC but not for trading ( either manual or automated ). MC should realize and provide importance to fix these nuances as soon as possible before looking at implementing enhancements in other areas.

Just my 2 cents.

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Andrew MultiCharts
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Re: Master Strategy : difficult to master

Postby Andrew MultiCharts » 02 Feb 2012

Dear Sirs,

Thank you for sharing your trading experience with us. It helps us to improve our software and make it more flexible and user-friendly for all users.
As i have promised Christian during our live chat conversation, I have discussed the situatation with our management and developer team and now we have a result. I can confirm that we are planning to implement such feature that will allow users to choose one of two ways of Master Strategy placement. A customer will be able to select whether he/she wants Master Strategy to be calculated and placed depending on open position quantity as it works right now, or he/she would like the exit orders to be sent to broker in that very way the user configured, no matter how the entry order contracts were filled.
We find current realization mostly efficient, but we totaly understand your frustration caused by it, that's why we are adding the feature. However, since the way it works at the moment was discussed several times in details and in all cases it was confirmed as correct expected behaviour, i would like you not to call this bug or problem further. I agree that it is a disadvantage though.
Thank you for your understanding.

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Andrew MultiCharts
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Re: Master Strategy : difficult to master

Postby Andrew MultiCharts » 02 Feb 2012

vking wrote:Unfortunately - autotrading with MC is not smooth either - due to limitations of power language :( and MC's point of view - they leave it as a feature rather than addressing them or providing a work around.

I like charting/controls much in MC but not for trading ( either manual or automated ). MC should realize and provide importance to fix these nuances as soon as possible before looking at implementing enhancements in other areas.

Just my 2 cents.


Hello Vking,

Since I am aware of both situations i think it is important to mention that your issue is not connected with the situation discussed in this topic. The feature you are looking for is confirmed for implementation: http://www.multicharts.com/pm/viewissue.php?issue_no=MC-454
Last edited by Andrew MultiCharts on 03 Feb 2012, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Master Strategy : difficult to master

Postby vking » 02 Feb 2012

Thanks Andrew. Yes I am aware that these 2 issues are not connected. Just that trying to express the importance of fixing these small issues in trading areas to have even better product.

PS: Thanks for the update on my PM request.

StratMan
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Re: Master Strategy : difficult to master

Postby StratMan » 03 Feb 2012

Andrew thank you for all the details and thank you to all your team for the quality of your service.

As English is not a language I fluently, I prefer to make some clarification on the issue I mention.

1) Master Strategy with MB Trading works perfectly !!!!!
For example, an limit order of 60 K opens a position of 60 K and the Master Strategy previously attached to this order executes correctly the various exits, stop loss or profit target.
Everything happens according to what a trader can expect from this Master Strategy. No bad surprises!

2) Master Strategy with FXCM has a behavior which may be different.
For example, an limit order of 60 K opens a position of 60 K but the Master Strategy attached to this order may turn into a Bracket Strategy by setting a single profit target for 60 K and a single Stop Loss for 60 K, at the prices of Level One parameters of the Master Strategy.
So, a behavior that is not specifically the one that the trader was waiting for ...

3) Master Strategy with FXCM, but Master Strategy attached after the position is open.
In this case, everything works properly, the different levels of Exits are generated correctly and everything works perfectly.

To summarize, in any case I mention, the open position quantity is always filled according to the initial order (an order for 60 K is executed for 60 K in all the cases) but in some cases, the exits are properly split and in other cases, they are merged ...

My personal problem is that I thought Master Strategy was designed to behave identically regardless of the broker.

Andrew, my misunderstanding of the behavior of this Master Strategy should not be interpreted as a criticism to you! I do not master the English language well so I may be not understand the original purpose of this strategy ...

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Re: Master Strategy : difficult to master

Postby manualtrader » 03 Feb 2012

Thank you for implementing the new feature for the manual traders, also sorry for using inaccurate words to describe the difficulties of Master Strategy. Also, please understand the frustration as a trader, I purchased MC lifetime license, but I have to pay other platform to trade now. Hope the option can be done ASAP, and I can be back to trade with MC.


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